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Post by LillaThrilla on Jun 27, 2010 16:00:53 GMT -5
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Post by LillaThrilla on Jun 27, 2010 16:13:05 GMT -5
I'll follow up with a question of my own regarding the Push scale:
Main Eventers: 80-100 Midcarders: 50-70 Low Carders 10-30
Could be further broken out? Maybe...
100 = World Champion (main title holder & serious contenders) 80 = US Title / IC Title (secondary title holder & serious contenders) 70 = TV Title level guys 30 = Jobbers To The Stars 10 = true jobbers (never ever win)
What about guys who are pushed really heavily but against really weak competition? I'm thinking Goldberg during most of his streak. Until he got the US Title he was pretty much just squashing jobbers yet he also had a ridiculous win streak. Push = 70?
What about tag teams? I seem to recall back in the day you would have themed tag teams that were very pushed as in tag matches but would be jobbed in singles matches. (Short answer: this is why we need Tag Teams to have their own Push stat LOL)
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Push
Jun 27, 2010 16:32:05 GMT -5
Post by tommybrownell on Jun 27, 2010 16:32:05 GMT -5
Well, you're exactly right about tag teams. Unfortunately, in TNM there is no great way to do it in a strict push fed because of that. These days it works fine, because a true tag team is a pair of jobbers to any two singles guys (and sometimes a single guy, look how often teams lose handicap matches) anyway.
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Crpls
Midcarder
Posts: 140
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Push
Jun 27, 2010 19:30:09 GMT -5
Post by Crpls on Jun 27, 2010 19:30:09 GMT -5
Well, if you were pushing Goldberg like WCW, he would never face the top guys at first anyway, so as long as he's 20+ everyone he's likely to face it'd be fine. If we start getting into the exceptions like Goldberg, you'd have to start booking at some point in TNM.
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Crpls
Midcarder
Posts: 140
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Push
Jun 27, 2010 19:31:43 GMT -5
Post by Crpls on Jun 27, 2010 19:31:43 GMT -5
As Tommy said, tag teams will cause problems unless you have a really segregated tag division. You'd either need to a) book if they face singles guys with big pushes or b) temp change push for those matches right from the booking screen.
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fwaroc
Enhancement Talent
Posts: 31
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Push
Aug 5, 2011 0:08:38 GMT -5
Post by fwaroc on Aug 5, 2011 0:08:38 GMT -5
I still want to make sure I understand this correctly. The ratio of damage/chances/etc. is only done when Strict Push is on?
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Push
Aug 5, 2011 9:03:51 GMT -5
Post by gentlemanjeff on Aug 5, 2011 9:03:51 GMT -5
I think the ratio is done regardless. Strict push is just more strict about it.
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badger
Curtain Jerker
Posts: 52
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Push
Dec 8, 2015 15:52:06 GMT -5
Post by badger on Dec 8, 2015 15:52:06 GMT -5
from the push FAQ:
This isn't really true in my experience. In my fed, I only have two push levels: one for champions, one for contenders. I use strict pushes and give the champions the advantage. This way, I don't have belts changing hands like crazy. I have had to give champions pushes of 100 and contenders pushes of 70 just to keep it the way I like it. And titles changes are still common. I just had my middleweight title switch twice, two shows in a row. So the whole "20 point difference almost guarantees a win" statement just is not true. Maybe 35.
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Push
Jul 20, 2020 13:06:08 GMT -5
Post by BeerGeek on Jul 20, 2020 13:06:08 GMT -5
That's the reason why I leave push blank on most (if not all) of my exports. Unlike Stamina, Workrate, Charisma, etc. I believe push is ultimately subjective and up to the user his/herself. Hell if I wanted to book Ric Flair as a jobber, I'm going to do it dammit...I won't do it, but still. LOL
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Post by tnmlyger on Jul 21, 2020 1:10:53 GMT -5
Quick update on this: I have been piloting two new options in the TNM TE 1.1 beta, damage normalization and damage scaling.
I intend to add these to TNM 7 SE, too, for Build 12 if I manage to free up the memory needed to handle them.
Damage normalization helps address the problem that wrestlers whose offense consists of high-impact moves will have an innate advantage over wrestlers with a more basic move set. All damage values from moves and counters will be dynamically scaled in every interaction to create a level playing field.
Damage scaling looks at the stats of two wrestlers in an exchange, and the bigger the difference between the two is, the more the damage done will be scaled up. This will give the stats more weight over other considerations.
In my experience, damage normalization has almost completely stopped legends from being squashed by current wrestlers. And damage scaling does a lot to make one-sided matches end more quickly.
Tag team pushes will not be coming to TNM 7 SE due to lack of available RAM in the match engine. I'm down to about 300 bytes of free space, and those aren't nearly enough to properly implement this. It's on the list for if I make a full version of TNM for Windows.
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badger
Curtain Jerker
Posts: 52
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Push
Mar 8, 2022 9:50:08 GMT -5
Post by badger on Mar 8, 2022 9:50:08 GMT -5
Tag team pushes will not be coming to TNM 7 SE due to lack of available RAM in the match engine. I'm down to about 300 bytes of free space, and those aren't nearly enough to properly implement this. It's on the list for if I make a full version of TNM for Windows. I was just coming to ask about something similar. By "tag team pushes," do you mean separate pushes for two guys when they're in a team as opposed to when they work single? Because I wanted to ask if pushes work at all with tag team wrestling in TNM. I run unbooked but use strict pushes so titles don't change hands like mad. Champions get a push of 100 while non-champions get 80 or 85 (I'm still tweaking it). Even with these numbers, titles do change hands, so it's fine. The exception is my tag team titles, which nobody seems to be able to hang on to. In my most recent run of 9 different tag champs, the most any of them has held it has been for one successful defense. So if both my tag champs have a push of 100 and the challengers have a push of 80, is that being ignored? Thanks!
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badger
Curtain Jerker
Posts: 52
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Push
Aug 12, 2022 8:44:51 GMT -5
Post by badger on Aug 12, 2022 8:44:51 GMT -5
Ugh. I'm about to abandon my tag titles in another new promotion I started because, again, setting pushes for tag teams (see above post) just doesn't work at all. With strict pushes on and a 25 point differential (as an experiment), my singles champions can't lose. But my tag belts are swapping almost every time they're defended. I can only conclude that push is ignored in tag matches.
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